As has been mentioned a number of times, car counts seem to be down.  Can you provide your top 5 reasons why you think they are down.  Costs will be up there, but what about other reasons.

Maybe this can be an eye-opener to some tracks on possible ways they can address this

Thanks

T-Hem

Big money teams make it hard to win. People need to work two jobs to make ends meet. Kids have so many activities that one parent can't be in two places at once. The price of everything related to building a car is nuts. There are fewer people who know how to work on cars. Us old guys learned who to fix things when we were kids and to make something out of nothing. We have generations of people now who can't fix anything, if it breaks buy another one , they don't even own the tools to fix anything . Neighbors come by the house all the time wanting something fixed or ask me if I want something they have that doesn't work anymore. The guy across the street just called and wants me to look at his new mower that won't start . He is one of my frequent fliers...lol. I can't make this stuff up. I miss racing but not the work it takes but I was blessed to have some great friends who made it possible. Phil Speno was one guy who made it all possible and the fun and laughter we had was worth more to me than any trophy.

And too many tracks racing on Saturday night so talent and cars are "diluted". I live in Bethlehem and ignoring sprints and macadam (they do draw cars and fans), I can be at the following dirt 'modified' tracks within 2 hours: Grandview, Bridgeport, New Egypt, OCFS and, when they were racing weekly, FMP. 

Reason #1- MONEY!  Back in the late 60s into the 70s, my neighbor ran a limited sportsman (today's sportsman or crate modified).  His wife didn't work, had 3 kids and made an average wage on a 10th grade education.  He never won a feature but was a freguent top 10 finisher.  Best night finish wise was a 4th and a 7th in twin 20s (or 15s) at Windsor.  I don't racers like him could compete today.  Maybe in a mini stock, or street stock.  In today's racing world, a good driver has to also been a good salesman, of himself.

Reason #2- AN AGING FAN BASE.  I think saturday night racing and Nascar are both presented with the problem of a lack new, incoming fans.  Back in my day (60s, 70s) a great number of fans      

Reason#2 cont'd- Regarding the aging fan base,  I don't think our 17 to 20 somethings are into cars like my generation was.  If you were a "car guy, or girl", chances are you attended a stock car or a drag race.  I think this applies to Nascar also. 

OBSERVATION- It would be nice (for me anyway) if New Egypt and Bridgeport could run a Friday- Saturday schedule.  However, I don't think it would increase car counts at either track as it just seems too expensive to run twice a week, especially for the sportsman crate guys (the purse they compete for).  Scott Ely

dnoldschool34 explains it all. People today just buy stuff,they can't even change a tire. Thats why the invented run flat tires. My grandkids don't even know what a ajustable wrench is, and you think they will work on race cars half the night? It's all about the money. No one builds anything anymore. So sad.

1) Cost

2) Availble time to work on the car.

3) Too many divisions that you can choose from.

4) Poorly managed shows. ie Down time, too many laps

Well in an earlier post I said a neighbor called about his mower not running and he wanted me to fix it. Well it was a brand new mower and it would run and die. Well it had chunks of leaves in the fuel tank . Now if we can put gas in a mower without dumping crap in the tank how do we think a guys like this is going to work on race cars. Younger generation, God help us all.

This damm geneartion now only wants to race cars and listen to Rock and Roll. They are useless. They should have been in the trenches fighting the war like us and saving our country and not spending all their money on loud cars. Damm kids these days, they will amount to nothing.

1955

1. Money

2. More money

3. Lack of money

4. Do I really want to spend my money on cars.

5. Depends on the area you live, is how much you want to race. ie South Florida, not at all, Upstate New York, plenty of tracks.

 I don't mean to be disrespectful, I know the young generation today is near useless, but every generation looks down upon the next like, who is going to keep this world going? It survives.

1-money
2-many divisions are suppo by 2nd and 3rd generation drivers. The old school roots go deep, but are slowly drying up.

3-less and less production car parts in the cars. 

4-many other types of motor sports out there.

5-and many more. I'm not blaming the tracks on anything. 

Today- Money, travel costs, Equipment costs!

Back in 1978 my my uncles race team ran in the sportsmen div. we ran Sat. if we made the sportsmen main we ran spl. Sunday shows at EW if we made money Sun top 10 we ran Fri, then Sat. and spl shows on Sun or Spl. Mod shows at Flemington we were a 5th to 10th place finisher in the sportsmen div. made some Modifed shows.

My uncle worked in the shop close to 7 days a during the  week from 6-to-11 and worked a full time job daily.

We did repairs on Race cars to make money to run the  race team, like most teams then you used to make your own parts, did most of your engine work. used to buy used tires from the bigger teams ran on donations. 

We may have had a month off in Dec. or started to prepair for the next year. 

Most teams run out of money or burn out, it's a rough sport and it's the life!

Getting down towards end of season, equipment broke or worn down, different engine rules and other rules  between tracks, the increased amount of dollars it takes to field and bring a car to a race event. Midweek shows 

Money.   Lincoln Speedway only had 23 410s [I know some were lost to Knoxville] but 41 305's.  The cost is out of sight.

Hours spent maintaining the car.  How many local 410's have a full time crew guy?

Can't come up with 5, I think that covers it.

#1 Cash flow issues 

#2 Burning up tires

#3 Rules limiting car from other tracks to come and race when teams might need a break from there home track 

# 4 Tech , Rules for theee but not for me

# 5 Burnout/ no fun 

#1:  Our society has run out of "tinkers", and sadly, society continues to make tinkers obsolute.  (Just to be clear, when I use the term tinker, I do so with the utmost respect, and do so using the definition as:  "One who enjoys experimenting with and repairing machine parts."

A few weeks ago I put up a post about how many teams there once were, that were anchored by an owner, who then had someone else drive their car.  Those guys had great mechanical knowledge, and they were tinkers.  There are so few "owners only" these days, you probably could count them on one hand... If you go back to the 60's, 70's and even into the 80's, I'd bet that 95% of those that were responsible for getting the car ready for raceday, owners and also owner/drivers were folks who had a solid understanding of how mechanical things worked.  Some had their own repair shops...  Some worked at plants/factories/DPWs in a dedicated Maintenance Dept that was responsible for anything that needed fixing... and guess what... They fixed it!  Amazing as it is to think this, these very talented folks actually enjoyed the nights in the garage, with a few buddies, figuring out the next whiz bang thing that was going to get them better results for the upcoming week.  They made the time to do it....   There was camaraderie... Yea it was "cubic time" but it wasn't "cubic $'s" so they "tinkered"... and had a sense of accomplishment when what they had thought of, designed, and then fabricated, produced results.

There are very few tinkers out there anymore, and for the few that are still out there, and once had an interest in racing, their skills have become threatened by today's more common buy/install/wreck/replace model.  Other than hammering out body panels, I'm not sure how much else can be done by an average team any more.  So often we hear that they had to take the car back to Bicknell, or whoever made it to make it right...  Engines are sealed (supposed to be sealed) so how much tinkering can actually be done on today's cars?

Folks like Wally Marks...  Fred Menschner....  Roy Pauch....  Kenny Brightbill.  They built it... They fixed it... and when it was time, they built something new.

Even outside of racing today, there aren't a lot of things that can be tinkered with... Everything is modular based, controled with a board/computer... and rarely can be fixed just by somebody tinkering with it.

If the furnace stopped working back in the day, dad went to the cellar with a flashlight, and somehow usually got it working again  Now, we go online and call somebody because there's a good chance some module/controller board needs to be replaced... After a visit or two, they figure out what's wrong, and we then wait because the part is probably on back order.....  Same thing for a lot of appliances... cars... mowers... stuff that could often be fixed with a little time and ingenuity, now often needs special equipment/software just to determine what is wrong, followed by component replacement rather than "adjusting, or tweaking."

No disrespect to those who are currently field cars and the tremendous effort they have to put in to do so, but I think even they would have to agree that there's a lot less welding/bending/fabricating on today's race cars, and quite a bit of remove/replace... Somebody with a twisted up racecar back in the 70's/80's could look at it, and figure on some long nights in the shop to fix it, but could justify the time knowing that they'd have a sense of accomplishment when fixed, versus somebody today who has to spend mega $'s buying/installing replacement parts needed to get back to the track.

While we're on this lack of tinkers and why, keep in mind that every race team needed a main tinker... but they also depended on a handful of others that were also willing to get their hands dirty... (2nd level tinkerer's!)  who were willing to spend a few nights in the garage during the week, and would be at the track on every race day without question.  While they didn't possess the same skills as the lead guy, there willingness to provide hands on help was a necessity for any race team.


#2:  Racing is family/generational, and there are less of the recent/upcoming generation that are following the path made before them into racing.

Less than 20 years ago, I could walk through the pits at New Egypt and almost every team had some connection to the past...  A father... A grandfather...  Many of the cars had that connection with a past generation, or in some cases maybe even two or 3 generations.  It seemed to be the norm...  Your dad's dad raced, so your dad raced...  And then when you became old enough, you raced...  As each new generation comes along, there are less that are interested in following the racing roots laid down by their racing relatives past/present.  Whether it is a lack of interest, a lack of $'s, (or probably both), or the next generation just not seeing the "why" behind all the work and $'s involved, they never take the wheel... or in some cases, maybe give it a try for a year or two...  And before you know it, a name that you thought would always be involved in the sport meets the end of the road.

Sure there are some current examples where the generations continue (Pauch's, Martz's, Godown's, etc.,.)  But there are also a lot that the family's racing lineage stopped sometime over the past 2 decades or so.  Some try it for a year or two...  Some not at all...  And when you lose that built in next generation "base" you either have to find others to replace it, or recognize that there will continue to be a decline in race teams/participants, as most tracks are seeing now.

#3:  Many "kids" are already burnt out on racing just about the time they would need to start their sportsman/modified career. 

For those born in the 50's, 60's and even the 70's, unless you had BS'd your way in, you probably had to wait until you were 18 years old in NJ (16 in PA) before you could race....  By then, the racing bug was building up inside and you, and a handful of buddies would do whatever it would take to field a car, and get one of you behind the wheel of a sportsman!  Now we have a bunch of kids that probably feel like their racing career is complete by the time they are 16!  (You know...been there, done that.)  Think about it...If they started racing at 5, that would mean that they've been racing for 10 years by the time they are sportsman ready...  How many of them feel like they've had enough "racing" and want to do other things in life?  And for those who have thoughts of continuing in racing, how many of them look at short track racing, (especially dirt) as a totally unnecessary step?  Hell, they have a room full of 1/4 midget, Karting, etc., trophies....  so for some of them, they're already thinking it's either Nascar or nevermind!

#4:  $'s.

I know a lot of folks will say that $'s should be #1for the decline in the amount of racecars, and they might be right, but for me, citing the high cost of racing today as the reason for it's decline is kind of the logical/sensible justification, but at what level does being logical/sensible apply when talking about short track racing?  My reason for listing $'s as #4 is because if we still had a society with a bunch of tinkers... and if the cars were still something where a team could be competitive by spending more time tinkering instead of maxing out another credit card at the speed shop counter, I think a few more of the old timers would have stayed in the game, and maybe brought a few young'ins along with them.

It has to get old pretty quick... constantly putting out $'s for tires, fuel, entry fees, replacement parts needed from wear or crash., or because something better/new is needed because... well, it's the next best thing that everybody has to have...  So yea, it's the $, but it's also the reality that you can't fix things/be competitive just by spending more time in the garage...  Today's teams have to be buying the right $tuff.

$'s are a huge reason why most guys stop racing... but I think the main reason why new folks don't get involved in the sport to begin with goes back to the lack of tinkers, and that you can't do it any longer just by tinkering.

#5:  Everything else that has been offered up by everyone who contributed to this thread.

Lots of solid reasons brought up by those that posted above, and I don't disagree with any of them.

Thanks for starting the thread T-Hem.

1.The entire world has changed. There seem to be way more activities for kids at a very young age. Social media has made it very important for kids to be involved in sports at a very young age. Parents plaster there kids all over the popular internet pages and non of that includes Auto Racing. 

2. As stated above not many tinkers or even guys who know more about cars then how to start one. Also stated above everything today is throw away and get another. Not fix it. 

3. Money. Don't get me wrong this is a big problem but I don't have it at the top because racing has always been very hard on the bank account. The thing is we always find a way to pay for things if we want it bad enough. I just don't think people want to race bad enough today for above reasons.

4&5 have been stated in above posts and I agree with all.

Very interesting stuff. 

Just to emphasize everyones point, I watched one of those well known delivery people bring two coffees and two bagels to my next door neighbors door over the weekend.  Didn't have the energy to get in the car and drive two blocks to go get it. I don't think he would make in our circles.

Thanks for so all the comments.  The tinkering one really resonated with me.  I remember making "sun tea" in a container with lemons and sitting outside.  Now I can go to a supermarket, and there are about 100 different types of iced teas, but no sun tea.  This has led me to Sundays, which were meeting at a family member's house to have a big lunch, and then the parents would play pinochle while the cousins would play games using sticks and old footballs. This past Sunday, I really could not remember what day it was as every day seemed like the next. 

Tom Petty has a phrase in one of his songs that says, "Life is such a drag when you are living in the past."  But is it?  Have we gotten away from the simpler things in life?  Where have all the local amusement parks gone?  Race Tracks? Local Five and Dime shops?  I understand things change, but remembering the past, I believe, can help with the future.

Have you ever tried to go without any or all of the below for one day? How do you think you would feel?

1) No T.V.

2) No Internet

3) No Cell Phone

4) No A/C in the car or house - use fans only

5) No Microwave

6) No Dishwasher

7) No store-bought Iced Tea, Coffee

Is it that by going forward, we have also regressed?

I recently saw a young person from where I live going to his baseball tournament, wearing a pair of sneakers for the car, one for getting out of the car, and cleats for his game.  He had a bat bag with 10 bats in it.  

When we played (no baseball on Sundays as it wasn't allowed), we played in sneakers, and when our bat broke, we taped it with electric tape and hoped it would stay together for the next at-bat.

Thanks for listening

T-Hem

Agree with a lot of the responses here. Money is biggest issue. Not enough of it for recreational hobbies. Costs have gone up 10 times, purses have gone up 5 times.  Parts availability in some cases. We waited 9 weeks for a set of pistons for an ASCS 360.  Hard to race without a motor. Gone are the days of building cars. Now we buy everything and assemble them.  Used to be if a frame got bent, got out the porta powers, or strapped frame to a big tree and fixed it.  Now, you throw away the frame and get another one.  Transportation cost alone keep some people from traveling. And rules, or in some cases the lack of.  Modifieds have to be different for each track, sanctioning bodies and classes.  I've said it before, there were weekends we would race East Windsor on Friday, Flemington on Saturday, Nazareth on Sunday, a special show on a Monday holiday at Syracuse and hit Five Mile Point on the way home from Syracuse, ALL with the same car on an open trailer. Try doing that today. 

As far as next generations, I am currently working with a third generation sprint car driver. Competed against and helped his Grandfather in the Modifieds and Sprints, was his father's crew chief in Central Pa. late 90's, early 2000's, now competing with USACec and URC. Definately an exception to the rule. And, at 67 years old, don't know how much longer I'll be doing this. It's in the blood, or it isn't.  JMO

Look at the people in the grandstands. Most elderly. Racing as we no it is comming to an end. Every year less cars. 

How many of you remember the blue laws when most businesses were closed sundays.  That when the parking lots would fill my with go-karts and minor bikes and have races.  Yes times seemed simpler and it got us outside to do things.  Rode our bicycles fixed our flats if we got one.  Customized them with banana seats high rise handle bars and other ideas we would come up with.  Like it was said we would tinker, today that's gone and the car culture is gone.

I remember one time, while building a bike that I bought for 50 cents, I decided to paint it using undercoating paint.  Every time I would ride the bike, I would be covered in the paint as it never totally dried.  I felt like a mechanic with all the paint/grease on me

I agree with just about everything that was posted above. Just want to add this. If someone were brand new to racing or moving out of ¼ Midgets in the NJ, Pa, area. You have way too many classes to choose from.

Starting with Asphalt, you have TQ’s, Legend cars, Fast Fours, Limited Late Models, Sportsman, and Modifieds.

 Dirt – Four Cylinders, Street Stocks, News Sprints, East Coast Sprints, 305 Mass Sprints, URC, Road Runners, Crates and Modifieds just in the full-size class.

This does not include Enduros, Micro Sprints, Sling Shots, or X-cel Modifieds. On top of any other class, I might have missed.

 Friday nights were mentioned in one of the posts above. Just an opinion any NJ Track that switches would be committing financial suicide. Between work, family or Friday night traffic you end up with less cars and fans sitting in the stands.

 More required equipment than back in the 60’s, 70’, and 80’s was not required. Now Transponders, Hans Devices, Fire Suppressions systems, Custom built racing seats, etc depending on the track are required.  Cheap tow vehicles and used trailers are rare to find, adding up to additional costs compared to the old days.

 The vast number of divisions thins the fields out in other classes. 

To the original poster Speaking about, no A/C, internet, TV, A/C, etc two summers ago. We lost power it went out from one of the storms for over 20 hours. Sleeping at night was brutal after years of sleeping with the A/C. If it was not for the smartphones you forget how much people are spoiled nowadays! 

Many good points listed here, $$$ seems to be a large component.  My son races asphalt QMs at wall and in PA.  It costs about $180 to put right side sneakers on one of these where a lot of teams are doing this every 2 weeks, so competing w/ that can be expensive and it shows in the low car counts we are seeing, especially in the heavier divisions that we compete in.  In NJ there are limited options for kids 13-16 if you can't fit in a QM anymore, so only option to continue on asphalt is a VERY LONG TOW!  If a kid isn't in a seat for a couple of years, chances of loosing interest down the road is probably a factor.  Look at the low car counts at Wall for 4 cylinders and legends an affordable next step!

Lindy Vacari had the right formula....1 class... big block mods ...no support classes...always drew 30plus cars/drivers...show started on time and you were out the door in 2 hours or so...

So many young drivers are fast tracked to the big leagues. The top three divisions of Nascar is full of 19 year olds. And it would be full of 14 year olds, if nascar let them.